And I also want our NFL all-stars to play in the next World Cup. New coach: Captain Robert Hatch.
I would love to see a soccer game with no cards and Roquan Smith gets a free shot at a little Portguese guy going up for a header.
@mark-milton so if you take an accounting we are still probably 16-35 in the world depending on the day. Miles away from the elite countries. An argument can be made mls hasn’t done much. Pay to play stronger than ever. And Mo State U has become a very solid D1 program. This fall they will have 28 internationals. Not a single Gallagher Lou fusz city sc nxt kid.
The other major problem, and it might be the most significant problem of all, is that the cost for playing at the old Academies and now MLS is astounding.
I kept track of my boys' expenses, including travel for each year:
U8-U10: 6k each a year which included coaching fees, travel and extra training. 36k over 3 years for both
U11-U12: 8k a year each. 32k over 2 years for both.
U13-U18: Academy levels: 9k a year each plus. My oldest kid's team was ranked number 1 for much of the year and they went to Texas, San Diego, St. Louis, Florida and Arizona. 6 years at a combined 18k a year for 108k total.
By U15 I figured out it was all bullshit and nothing more than a money-making opportunity. I also figured out that even though both my kids started, neither was in the top 5 players on the team, and if you ain't in the top 5, you quicky discover that the coach doesn't give a crap about you.
I bet Scott Gallagher is right up there in costs.
You weed out a lot of really good athletes and players with the cost. Being a big fish in a small pond is important, but playing with better players is really important as well.
The most shambolic business model in sports.
This is not that different than other activities/sports (see AAU basketball or my $20K+/yr dance bill for a 10-year-old). That being said, the bigger clubs here give out plenty of scholarships and aid packages to those who need them.
More importantly, do you really think it is that much cheaper in Europe? If anything, I would expect it to be more (supply vs. demand, lack of alternatives).
Lastly, that doesn't explain why poorer countries in LatAm have so much success. The culture, playing style, and interest are just different.
@jdb there’s no greater punishment than dance according to my dance dad buddies. Lessons. Outfits. Headshots. Competitions
@mark-milton so if you take an accounting we are still probably 16-35 in the world depending on the day. Miles away from the elite countries. An argument can be made mls hasn’t done much. Pay to play stronger than ever. And Mo State U has become a very solid D1 program. This fall they will have 28 internationals. Not a single Gallagher Lou fusz city sc nxt kid.
The other major problem, and it might be the most significant problem of all, is that the cost for playing at the old Academies and now MLS is astounding.
I kept track of my boys' expenses, including travel for each year:
U8-U10: 6k each a year which included coaching fees, travel and extra training. 36k over 3 years for both
U11-U12: 8k a year each. 32k over 2 years for both.
U13-U18: Academy levels: 9k a year each plus. My oldest kid's team was ranked number 1 for much of the year and they went to Texas, San Diego, St. Louis, Florida and Arizona. 6 years at a combined 18k a year for 108k total.
By U15 I figured out it was all bullshit and nothing more than a money-making opportunity. I also figured out that even though both my kids started, neither was in the top 5 players on the team, and if you ain't in the top 5, you quicky discover that the coach doesn't give a crap about you.
I bet Scott Gallagher is right up there in costs.
You weed out a lot of really good athletes and players with the cost. Being a big fish in a small pond is important, but playing with better players is really important as well.
The most shambolic business model in sports.
1000%. I didn't keep track of the daughter's related expenses b/c I'd probably have started taking heroin. the really dumb thing is between HamCo Indiana (the rich suburb of Indy) and the other ring suburbs there is more than enough talent and teams to keep everybody busy but for some reason we have to go to BFE Pennsylvania b/c there's teams there in our "league". Ridiculous.
The youth development in this country is fucked and until that changes, so are we. Probably the three best players on the pitch for the USMNT this tourney were Tillman (born in Germany), Mckennie (first three years of organized soccer in Germany), and Tyler Adams (in an MLS academy at 13).
@bar-down isn't wrong that there is a cultural/DNA component to this. When nutmegging a guy gains the same stature as crossing a guy over in basketball and sitting him down (ooohhh, ahhhhh) we'll know we're getting somewhere. But our youth development ahs to be radically transformed. I think the MLS academies are making it better. I think. I don't really know. but the real development occurs from age 6-11. That's where we need to focus. And Landon Donovan isn't wrong. It's a rich kid sport at those ages. It needs to be an everybody sport.
More importantly, do you really think it is that much cheaper in Europe? If anything, I would expect it to be more (supply vs. demand, lack of alternatives).
At the youth level, yes. Yes, it is. Now, it has its own set of problems. They leave kids by the wayside and often fuck wtih their educational development along the way.
Watch the Jamie Vardy doc on Netflix. It's really good.
@mark-milton so if you take an accounting we are still probably 16-35 in the world depending on the day. Miles away from the elite countries. An argument can be made mls hasn’t done much. Pay to play stronger than ever. And Mo State U has become a very solid D1 program. This fall they will have 28 internationals. Not a single Gallagher Lou fusz city sc nxt kid.
The other major problem, and it might be the most significant problem of all, is that the cost for playing at the old Academies and now MLS is astounding.
I kept track of my boys' expenses, including travel for each year:
U8-U10: 6k each a year which included coaching fees, travel and extra training. 36k over 3 years for both
U11-U12: 8k a year each. 32k over 2 years for both.
U13-U18: Academy levels: 9k a year each plus. My oldest kid's team was ranked number 1 for much of the year and they went to Texas, San Diego, St. Louis, Florida and Arizona. 6 years at a combined 18k a year for 108k total.
By U15 I figured out it was all bullshit and nothing more than a money-making opportunity. I also figured out that even though both my kids started, neither was in the top 5 players on the team, and if you ain't in the top 5, you quicky discover that the coach doesn't give a crap about you.
I bet Scott Gallagher is right up there in costs.
You weed out a lot of really good athletes and players with the cost. Being a big fish in a small pond is important, but playing with better players is really important as well.
The most shambolic business model in sports.
This is not that different than other activities/sports (see AAU basketball or my $20K+/yr dance bill for a 10-year-old). That being said, the bigger clubs here give out plenty of scholarships and aid packages to those who need them.
More importantly, do you really think it is that much cheaper in Europe? If anything, I would expect it to be more (supply vs. demand, lack of alternatives).
Lastly, that doesn't explain why poorer countries in LatAm have so much success. The culture, playing style, and interest are just different.
By my last check, only the MLS teams provide scholarships/aid because they have some resources, but it isn't for everyone. 6 of both my kids' buddies went to the following: (1) Columbus Crew; (2) Sporting KC; (3) Philadelphia Union; (4) Portland Timbers and (5) Atlanta United. Nobody received a dime in assistance. Two of them are playing in MLS now.
Europe is different. If you are invited to play at an academy, the academies pay for it all. If you aren't in academy, the travel is significantly reduced, and the fees are way less. They aren't pricing out people.
None of these issues are mutually exclusive but rather additive.
Shoving carrramrod into a locker since 2024.
Yeah, like how did you learn to throw a baseball or shoot a free throw? Your dad. What if your dad never thew a baseball, never saw a basketball before?@dbmhoosier i think we got rid of every other sport and only played soccer we'd still basically be the same. i don't think it's a numbers issue . i think it's a century of quality dna we are lacking. messi's goal was obscene. there are no words for how hard it is to keep that ball down as the only way to hit it is how he did and a shitty player would have basically missed it completely and a quality player sent it way over the bar without much power. only he can keep that ball down
It's cultural
My dad tried to play catch with me a few times. I played basketball.
I'll contend that it's not just dad's, but kids getting out and playing with other kids. That's how I got better. I was fortunate that I grew up around a core group of 7 or 8 kids around the block that all played sports, all day everyday (many are still my best friends).
This is gonna sound weird, but the new Toy Story movie is dead on. Kids don't know how to interact anymore. Screen time has killed that skill.
@dbmhoosier people said the same things back in 2002. The U.S. just needs blah blah blah. The reality is football and basketball are better sports and elite U.S. athletes specialize in those and not soccer.
The reality is football and basketball are better sports and elite U.S. athletes specialize in those and not soccer.
right and tariffs aren't inflationary....
I'm having to flip to page two for things you don't understand
I'll contend that it's not just dad's, but kids getting out and playing with other kids. That's how I got better.
Well that and, like me, being 6'3"
I learned how to dribble on a gravel driveway. Dad had a hoop up on the side of the house by the time i was 7. Same thing though, friends in the neighborhood. used to play at a kids house in the winter. We'd shovel the snow off and dry the asphalt with newspapers. He lived with his grandmother and they had a wood burning stove. She'd bring out the ashes and some coals so we could keep our hands warm. Good times.
I'll contend that it's not just dad's, but kids getting out and playing with other kids. That's how I got better.
Well that and, like me, being 6'3"
I learned how to dribble on a gravel driveway. Dad had a hoop up on the side of the house by the time i was 7. Same thing though, friends in the neighborhood. used to play at a kids house in the winter. We'd shovel the snow off and dry the asphalt with newspapers. He lived with his grandmother and they had a wood burning stove. She'd bring out the ashes and some coals so we could keep our hands warm. Good times.
Young lars and friends...
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@dbmhoosier people said the same things back in 2002. The U.S. just needs blah blah blah. The reality is football and basketball are better sports and elite U.S. athletes specialize in those and not soccer.
It strikes me that it’s not the same kind of athletes. There seems to be some benefit in soccer to being smaller and having a lower center of gravity. With some notable exceptions of course like that Viking guy.
Im not sure it’s a given LeBron or Myles Garrett would be great soccer players even if they trained from their youth.
edit: On the flip side, it’s hard to imagine someone like Tyreek Hill or the average NFL running back wouldn’t be the best soccer player in the world if they committed to it.
I'll contend that it's not just dad's, but kids getting out and playing with other kids. That's how I got better.
Well that and, like me, being 6'3"
I learned how to dribble on a gravel driveway. Dad had a hoop up on the side of the house by the time i was 7. Same thing though, friends in the neighborhood. used to play at a kids house in the winter. We'd shovel the snow off and dry the asphalt with newspapers. He lived with his grandmother and they had a wood burning stove. She'd bring out the ashes and some coals so we could keep our hands warm. Good times.
Young lars and friends...
I was really just trying to remind @bradstevens that both Boogie and I are 6'3". he seems to like that.
But we did run the picket fence in that driveway. Ahhh, the memories.