@gros-louis I kind of agree. I think there are probably different versions of "right". I think a coach that always has a winning record, is routinely a top 6-7 B10 regular season team, but has a team every 3-4 years that has the horses to legit compete for a natty, would be "right". A Gard/Painter esque program that gets to top 3-4 every year, and is solid, and returns lots of guys most years, and competes for 2nd weekends a lot... is also "right". I'd choose the first one if given the choice.
But I don't see a scenario where we get a coach that has IU at the top of the B10 every year, and has FF level teams most years. I don't know why it couldn't happen, I just can't envision it.
There are probably 5-6 programs in the current Big Ten that could develop into a consistent top league team and be in the Final Four conversation every year. Indiana is definitely one of those programs. There are a lot of 'good' teams in the Big Ten that can be dangerous every few years, but IU and a handful of other teams are the only ones that have the potential to be juggernauts year in and year out. In addition to IU, I'd say UCLA, Michigan, Michigan State, Ohio State and probably Oregon. Michigan seems to be there now. The big IFs for the other schools are NIL commitment and finding the right head coach who can recruit top players. The NIL piece is such a huge factor.
I applaud your faith in this program. I don't know who the next coach will be, so I can't speculate on how he'll do. But I'd be shocked if DD's IU ever finishes ahead of Purdue in the B1G. And I certainly don't envision an E8 run.But would I trade our next 10 years for theirs? Nope.
No one is right or wrong until more games are played, but the arrow is pointing South.
Michigan has as many Final Four appearances over time as we do. And there's never been a shortage of resources there.@gros-louis I kind of agree. I think there are probably different versions of "right". I think a coach that always has a winning record, is routinely a top 6-7 B10 regular season team, but has a team every 3-4 years that has the horses to legit compete for a natty, would be "right". A Gard/Painter esque program that gets to top 3-4 every year, and is solid, and returns lots of guys most years, and competes for 2nd weekends a lot... is also "right". I'd choose the first one if given the choice.
But I don't see a scenario where we get a coach that has IU at the top of the B10 every year, and has FF level teams most years. I don't know why it couldn't happen, I just can't envision it.
There are probably 5-6 programs in the current Big Ten that could develop into a consistent top league team and be in the Final Four conversation every year. Indiana is definitely one of those programs. There are a lot of 'good' teams in the Big Ten that can be dangerous every few years, but IU and a handful of other teams are the only ones that have the potential to be juggernauts year in and year out. In addition to IU, I'd say UCLA, Michigan, Michigan State, Ohio State and probably Oregon. Michigan seems to be there now. The big IFs for the other schools are NIL commitment and finding the right head coach who can recruit top players. The NIL piece is such a huge factor.
@gthomas Shocked? Really? We're 2 coaches removed from doing that fairly routinely for decades. And CDD finished in either 1st or 2nd place in the Valley 5 out of his 6 years there. Not saying CDD will overtake Painter and PU, and finish higher than them every year... but I certainly wouldn't be shocked if he did it once or twice over the next handful of years...
Michigan has as many Final Four appearances over time as we do. And there's never been a shortage of resources there.
Totally get it. If they could have historically avoided cheating scandals and NCAA violations, they might have been even better. I'd guess they're top 3-5 in all time wins in the Big Ten too.
@gthomas Shocked? Really? We're 2 coaches removed from doing that fairly routinely for decades. And CDD finished in either 1st or 2nd place in the Valley 5 out of his 6 years there. Not saying CDD will overtake Painter and PU, and finish higher than them every year... but I certainly wouldn't be shocked if he did it once or twice over the next handful of years...
One thing I'm shocked by is the number of people who are ready to move on from Devries now. He took over a team with no roster and almost made the NCAA tournament. I get being in wait-and-see mode, but damn, this year could have been A LOT worse.
@ohio-guy I'm up and down on varying versions of that "CDD isn't the guy" take. I think he did some good things in his first 12 months at IU. And I think he did some bad things in his first 12 months at IU. I'm excited about some of the things I saw, and the potential of where those things could go and what they could become. And I'm nervous about the bad things, and what those could hold us back to being.
Good things... his offensive style was fun to watch (when they ran it consistently). Numerous players adapted and figured out how to contribute to solid overall basketball, throughout the season. Tucker became much more of a facilitator, defender, rebounder as the year wore on. Lamar became much more well rounded of a scorer as the year wore on. Sam improved and became much more assertive later in the year. Our defense was actually fairly solid, for not having really any sort of rim protection.
Bad things... consistency was really an issue all year. Too reliant on the 3 point shot. A couple really bad portal misses on guys that needed to be key contributors (Bailey and Conerway). And no rim protecting big on the roster was a big miss before the season even started.
Not much else to do, right now, but to see how he builds his 2nd roster, who stays, who he brings in, etc... As I've said before, if we have a team made up of similar types of guys, and lack similar things, to his first IU team... I honestly don't think he'll survive another 12 months at IU. But if he brings in some more size, physicality, more depth of athleticism... It'll be very interesting to see what his system can do with that. I think he could make a big jump this next year if he's able to put a roster together that has a good blend of skill, size, and athleticism. He's taken two successive teams to the brink of the NCAA tournament, both with major injury issues, and both with gaping flaws and holes on his roster. When he's had more well rounded rosters, versus his peers, he's done fine. I think he has just as good a chance succeed at IU, as he doesn't. We'll see how it goes though!
The point is with Painter, the guy wins 25-30 games a year but despite that, he cannot land top 25 guys to get him over the top.
Their talent coming in in 2026 is on par with IU, and honestly, if I was a Purdue fan, that would be unacceptable. IU hasn't won anything for 10 years and they're still getting as good or better talent than Purdue.
Sort of makes no sense, other than all the jokes about Purdue that follow. But if you think about it, its really their program settling for less. I mean, how hard could it be to convince a kid that you can win, when you have 20+ years of success and several deep tourney runs?
]The point is with Painter, the guy wins 25-30 games a year but despite that, he cannot land top 25 guys to get him over the top.
Their talent coming in in 2026 is on par with IU, and honestly, if I was a Purdue fan, that would be unacceptable. IU hasn't won anything for 10 years and they're still getting as good or better talent than Purdue.
Sort of makes no sense, other than all the jokes about Purdue that follow. But if you think about it, its really their program settling for less. I mean, how hard could it be to convince a kid that you can win, when you have 20+ years of success and several deep tourney runs?
The way i look at is is like this no big ten team has had the talent to win it in 25 years so how is purdue any different. They did make a final game a few years ago. Michigan this year might finally have it but most big ten teams have not had it for a long time. I am not defending purdue but until the big ten wins it what they are doing works
@gthomas Shocked? Really? We're 2 coaches removed from doing that fairly routinely for decades. And CDD finished in either 1st or 2nd place in the Valley 5 out of his 6 years there. Not saying CDD will overtake Painter and PU, and finish higher than them every year... but I certainly wouldn't be shocked if he did it once or twice over the next handful of years...
One thing I'm shocked by is the number of people who are ready to move on from Devries now. He took over a team with no roster and almost made the NCAA tournament. I get being in wait-and-see mode, but damn, this year could have been A LOT worse.
Nobody said move on we simply said he does not seem like the guy who is going to make deep runs in the tourney. I really dont care what he did before in this day and age you can win right away you dont need four years.
Their campus/town is a dump compared to Indiana/Bloomington. Worse basketball + better campus. On balance evens out for recruits. Just imagine if we could ever win.The point is with Painter, the guy wins 25-30 games a year but despite that, he cannot land top 25 guys to get him over the top.
Their talent coming in in 2026 is on par with IU, and honestly, if I was a Purdue fan, that would be unacceptable. IU hasn't won anything for 10 years and they're still getting as good or better talent than Purdue. ...
Their campus/town is a dump compared to Indiana/Bloomington. Worse basketball + better campus. On balance evens out for recruits. Just imagine if we could ever win.
I've heard in the age of NIL, portal and online classes, the actual campus doesn't matter as much to players. As long your program is the highest bidder and the check clears, most guys are going to come to your school, live in as nice of an off-campus apartment they can find and probably not roam campus too much.
I remember reading something about Ohio State football players basically spending most of their time at the Woody Hayes Athletic Center either taking classes setting up especially for them there or taking their classes online. That kind of set up is becoming more and more common.
Their campus/town is a dump compared to Indiana/Bloomington. Worse basketball + better campus. On balance evens out for recruits. Just imagine if we could ever win.
I've heard in the age of NIL, portal and online classes, the actual campus doesn't matter as much to players. As long your program is the highest bidder and the check clears, most guys are going to come to your school, live in as nice of an off-campus apartment they can find and probably not roam campus too much.
I remember reading something about Ohio State football players basically spending most of their time at the Woody Hayes Athletic Center either taking classes setting up especially for them there or taking their classes online. That kind of set up is becoming more and more common.
I doubt half these guys even go to class the campus is something they probably only see on game days.. These are paid professional ahtletes now nobody is doing a mormom mission at BYU anymore they are all their for paycheck and that is it. People need to understand these are no longer student athletes period.
The era of the "student-athlete" is over. Sure, there are a few still doing it. The much maligned Anthony Leal finished his Kelley undergrad in 3 years. But the NBA-bound guys are doing online classes and whatever minimally qualifies them as "students" in the eyes of the NCAA and I doubt they ever finish a degree. The teams like RMK had, where he would bench a kid who was caught cutting class, and nearly every player graduated, are a thing of the past.
Purdue may be a holdout in that sense, and maybe why they have trouble getting any of the really elite players. Maybe Painter srill expects them to be students. Just speculation...