@surjay This "hater" and "you want IU to lose" shit is getting old. I'm simply anti-mediocrity, that's all.
We're all anti mediocrity. Sorry if we just don't think running off a coach after one season and a likely NCAA tournament birth is the best way to get past mediocrity.
@surjay This "hater" and "you want IU to lose" shit is getting old. I'm simply anti-mediocrity, that's all.
As is the whole "you don't understand the landscape of college basketball bs". Speaking solely for myself, I've watched college and HS basketball for 60 years, and I'm pretty damn sure I understand the landscape of college basketball, and can also recognize good and bad coaching.
I pretty much give CDD a pass on the roster. CDD had trouble putting a staff together, but there were some unusual circumstances there. His best assistant played at Illinois and hated IU. And his other top assistant got a head coaching job. I think his best player went with his top assistant (?). Understandable but unfortunate. His other returning players may just not have been worthwhile. Wilkerson & Enright have probably been better than expected. TD as expected. None of Conerway, Dorn, Miles, Alexis or Bailey have been a major positive surprise, but none have been completely worthless.
What concerns me more are the coaching deficiencies I've seen. From the beginning, poor shot selection on the part of DeVries & Wilkerson. I will acknowledge some improvement from both as the year went along. On D, tons of silly reach penalties. which has continued throughout the year. Frequently losing big leads.....Wisconsin, Purdue, Iowa, Nebraska, even a couple of the crap teams at the beginning of the year. A lack of competitiveness/combativeness on road games at MSU, Purdue, Illinois, Michigan. Losing the loose balls to more competitive teams throughout the year. Flying through the air at shot fakes, while employing few shot fakes of our own.
"CDD's not a weirdo".....yikes, high praise. Are our players ready to bust their balls for him? Doesn't look like it to me. They seem fairly comfortable with losing....just talking about how "we need to learn from this". Wtf, how many lessons do they need to learn? Bad thing....coach says the same bs. I need to hear some "this is not acceptable". I want to see more competitive fire from the guy, and not just on the road. Get a T or two when we're getting screwed on the road by the refs!! He is not respected, clearly. The 'Door Nob' tag fits.
I'm not ready to say he's as bad as Woodson, Miller & Davis. I'm not convinced he's better than Crean.
Which brings us to next year. One thing most of us can agree on....we need some rich guy/guys to hand over $15M or so in NIL. Issue is.....if you had the means, would you want to spend it on this coach? Or for getting rid of this one?
@dbmhoosier This team has a hell of a lot more to do to make the tournament at this point. Anyone declaring them a tourney team about a week ago was way premature. And if they don’t make it that’s a big fat failure, no rationalizing it.
@surjay This "hater" and "you want IU to lose" shit is getting old. I'm simply anti-mediocrity, that's all.
As is the whole "you don't understand the landscape of college basketball bs". Speaking solely for myself, I've watched college and HS basketball for 60 years, and I'm pretty damn sure I understand the landscape of college basketball, and can also recognize good and bad coaching.
I pretty much give CDD a pass on the roster. CDD had trouble putting a staff together, but there were some unusual circumstances there. His best assistant played at Illinois and hated IU. And his other top assistant got a head coaching job. I think his best player went with his top assistant (?). Understandable but unfortunate. His other returning players may just not have been worthwhile. Wilkerson & Enright have probably been better than expected. TD as expected. None of Conerway, Dorn, Miles, Alexis or Bailey have been a major positive surprise, but none have been completely worthless.
What concerns me more are the coaching deficiencies I've seen. From the beginning, poor shot selection on the part of DeVries & Wilkerson. I will acknowledge some improvement from both as the year went along. On D, tons of silly reach penalties. which has continued throughout the year. Frequently losing big leads.....Wisconsin, Purdue, Iowa, Nebraska, even a couple of the crap teams at the beginning of the year. A lack of competitiveness/combativeness on road games at MSU, Purdue, Illinois, Michigan. Losing the loose balls to more competitive teams throughout the year. Flying through the air at shot fakes, while employing few shot fakes of our own.
"CDD's not a weirdo".....yikes, high praise. Are our players ready to bust their balls for him? Doesn't look like it to me. They seem fairly comfortable with losing....just talking about how "we need to learn from this". Wtf, how many lessons do they need to learn? Bad thing....coach says the same bs. I need to hear some "this is not acceptable". I want to see more competitive fire from the guy, and not just on the road. Get a T or two when we're getting screwed on the road by the refs!! He is not respected, clearly. The 'Door Nob' tag fits.
I'm not ready to say he's as bad as Woodson, Miller & Davis. I'm not convinced he's better than Crean.
Which brings us to next year. One thing most of us can agree on....we need some rich guy/guys to hand over $15M or so in NIL. Issue is.....if you had the means, would you want to spend it on this coach? Or for getting rid of this one?
amen brother. You and I are in the same page. I gave him the moniker of Doorknob and I'm standing by it.
someone mentioned he needs to build a culture ..., I don't see one ... I see lack of effort , poor discipline at times as you mentioned.
and culture... he needs a whole new cast of characters again. How does that carry over?? It's like Groundhog Day here.
And I agree the whole "he's not a weirdo" I'll take a weirdo who wins , I'm not too picky when it comes to that
@surjay This "hater" and "you want IU to lose" shit is getting old. I'm simply anti-mediocrity, that's all.
As is the whole "you don't understand the landscape of college basketball bs". Speaking solely for myself, I've watched college and HS basketball for 60 years, and I'm pretty damn sure I understand the landscape of college basketball, and can also recognize good and bad coaching.
I pretty much give CDD a pass on the roster. CDD had trouble putting a staff together, but there were some unusual circumstances there. His best assistant played at Illinois and hated IU. And his other top assistant got a head coaching job. I think his best player went with his top assistant (?). Understandable but unfortunate. His other returning players may just not have been worthwhile. Wilkerson & Enright have probably been better than expected. TD as expected. None of Conerway, Dorn, Miles, Alexis or Bailey have been a major positive surprise, but none have been completely worthless.
What concerns me more are the coaching deficiencies I've seen. From the beginning, poor shot selection on the part of DeVries & Wilkerson. I will acknowledge some improvement from both as the year went along. On D, tons of silly reach penalties. which has continued throughout the year. Frequently losing big leads.....Wisconsin, Purdue, Iowa, Nebraska, even a couple of the crap teams at the beginning of the year. A lack of competitiveness/combativeness on road games at MSU, Purdue, Illinois, Michigan. Losing the loose balls to more competitive teams throughout the year. Flying through the air at shot fakes, while employing few shot fakes of our own.
"CDD's not a weirdo".....yikes, high praise. Are our players ready to bust their balls for him? Doesn't look like it to me. They seem fairly comfortable with losing....just talking about how "we need to learn from this". Wtf, how many lessons do they need to learn? Bad thing....coach says the same bs. I need to hear some "this is not acceptable". I want to see more competitive fire from the guy, and not just on the road. Get a T or two when we're getting screwed on the road by the refs!! He is not respected, clearly. The 'Door Nob' tag fits.
I'm not ready to say he's as bad as Woodson, Miller & Davis. I'm not convinced he's better than Crean.
Which brings us to next year. One thing most of us can agree on....we need some rich guy/guys to hand over $15M or so in NIL. Issue is.....if you had the means, would you want to spend it on this coach? Or for getting rid of this one?
amen brother. You and I are in the same page. I gave him the moniker of Doorknob and I'm standing by it.
someone mentioned he needs to build a culture ..., I don't see one ... I see lack of effort , poor discipline at times as you mentioned.
and culture... he needs a whole new cast of characters again. How does that carry over?? It's like Groundhog Day here.And I agree the whole "he's not a weirdo" I'll take a weirdo who wins , I'm not too picky when it comes to that
I forgot the k in Doorknob. I thought it looked strange......
About CDD.......he was 17 years as an assistant coach. He was probably a damn good assistant coach. I saw when we hired him that McDermitt said he was 'the most competitive guy he knew' or something to that effect. Like you, I haven't seen it. What is the 'culture'? I've seen that he's never had a T as a head coach? Is that true? If so, I'd think that alone would be damn near disqualifying, unless you're a damn genius, which he definitely is not. To me, he just looks like a buddy to his players. His mantra is play hard. That should be a given. He should assume that will happen, and go on to 'play smart'. But 'play hard' hasn't even been a given. Purdue was getting every fricking loose ball last night. That's happened against all of the competitive teams we've played when we weren't at home. And the fans know it. That's why we're getting 13000 at the games. They haven't bought in.
"You can't build a culture in Year 1" coming in 3, 2, 1...
Please, show me where I said King Knobulous should be canned after his first season.@surjay This "hater" and "you want IU to lose" shit is getting old. I'm simply anti-mediocrity, that's all.
We're all anti mediocrity. Sorry if we just don't think running off a coach after one season and a likely NCAA tournament birth is the best way to get past mediocrity.
Please, show me where I said King Knobulous should be canned after his first season.@surjay This "hater" and "you want IU to lose" shit is getting old. I'm simply anti-mediocrity, that's all.
We're all anti mediocrity. Sorry if we just don't think running off a coach after one season and a likely NCAA tournament birth is the best way to get past mediocrity.
I was the one who said that ... not @gthomas
@surjay This "hater" and "you want IU to lose" shit is getting old. I'm simply anti-mediocrity, that's all.
As is the whole "you don't understand the landscape of college basketball bs". Speaking solely for myself, I've watched college and HS basketball for 60 years, and I'm pretty damn sure I understand the landscape of college basketball, and can also recognize good and bad coaching.
I pretty much give CDD a pass on the roster. CDD had trouble putting a staff together, but there were some unusual circumstances there. His best assistant played at Illinois and hated IU. And his other top assistant got a head coaching job. I think his best player went with his top assistant (?). Understandable but unfortunate. His other returning players may just not have been worthwhile. Wilkerson & Enright have probably been better than expected. TD as expected. None of Conerway, Dorn, Miles, Alexis or Bailey have been a major positive surprise, but none have been completely worthless.
What concerns me more are the coaching deficiencies I've seen. From the beginning, poor shot selection on the part of DeVries & Wilkerson. I will acknowledge some improvement from both as the year went along. On D, tons of silly reach penalties. which has continued throughout the year. Frequently losing big leads.....Wisconsin, Purdue, Iowa, Nebraska, even a couple of the crap teams at the beginning of the year. A lack of competitiveness/combativeness on road games at MSU, Purdue, Illinois, Michigan. Losing the loose balls to more competitive teams throughout the year. Flying through the air at shot fakes, while employing few shot fakes of our own.
"CDD's not a weirdo".....yikes, high praise. Are our players ready to bust their balls for him? Doesn't look like it to me. They seem fairly comfortable with losing....just talking about how "we need to learn from this". Wtf, how many lessons do they need to learn? Bad thing....coach says the same bs. I need to hear some "this is not acceptable". I want to see more competitive fire from the guy, and not just on the road. Get a T or two when we're getting screwed on the road by the refs!! He is not respected, clearly. The 'Door Nob' tag fits.
I'm not ready to say he's as bad as Woodson, Miller & Davis. I'm not convinced he's better than Crean.
Which brings us to next year. One thing most of us can agree on....we need some rich guy/guys to hand over $15M or so in NIL. Issue is.....if you had the means, would you want to spend it on this coach? Or for getting rid of this one?
amen brother. You and I are in the same page. I gave him the moniker of Doorknob and I'm standing by it.
someone mentioned he needs to build a culture ..., I don't see one ... I see lack of effort , poor discipline at times as you mentioned.
and culture... he needs a whole new cast of characters again. How does that carry over?? It's like Groundhog Day here.And I agree the whole "he's not a weirdo" I'll take a weirdo who wins , I'm not too picky when it comes to that
I forgot the k in Doorknob. I thought it looked strange......
About CDD.......he was 17 years as an assistant coach. He was probably a damn good assistant coach. I saw when we hired him that McDermitt said he was 'the most competitive guy he knew' or something to that effect. Like you, I haven't seen it. What is the 'culture'? I've seen that he's never had a T as a head coach? Is that true? If so, I'd think that alone would be damn near disqualifying, unless you're a damn genius, which he definitely is not. To me, he just looks like a buddy to his players. His mantra is play hard. That should be a given. He should assume that will happen, and go on to 'play smart'. But 'play hard' hasn't even been a given. Purdue was getting every fricking loose ball last night. That's happened against all of the competitive teams we've played when we weren't at home. And the fans know it. That's why we're getting 13000 at the games. They haven't bought in.
It's been pretty obvious to me since day 1. I think more are starting to see it. And some don't want to see it. Unfortunately, the powers that be won't fire him after one year but imo they should. We've all been scarred by the Archie and Bigfoot experiments that now this guy looks like the second coming.
@hoosiers94 They are not firing him after one year. A year that could have him in the NCAA Tournament. Are there issues with this team? Yes. are they of the coach's doing? Yes, it all falls on his shoulders.
If IU loses out or misses the Tournament, his leash could shorten. IU has missed the NCAA Tournament the last two seasons, so firing a coach for making it, will just put IU into a bigger hole. It's clearly not the job it used to be and there are a lot of reasons for that. It can't just be spoken into existence.
I have said it multiple times, this offseason will determine how long the DeVries Era lasts.
@hoosiers94 They are not firing him after one year. A year that could have him in the NCAA Tournament. Are there issues with this team? Yes. are they of the coach's doing? Yes, it all falls on his shoulders.
If IU loses out or misses the Tournament, his leash could shorten. IU has missed the NCAA Tournament the last two seasons, so firing a coach for making it, will just put IU into a bigger hole. It's clearly not the job it used to be and there are a lot of reasons for that. It can't just be spoken into existence.
I have said it multiple times, this offseason will determine how long the DeVries Era lasts.
Ive acknowledged that , doesn't mean I agree , and many of you assume it will put us in a deeper hole... what about if he tanks next season. And doesn't make it in this season. I'd say that is a deeper hole as well. Things can go several ways. We could fire him and make a hire that actually works and then we'd not be deeper in a hole. No one knows. But using black and white stances on things gets you the same ole same ole
@hoosiers94 I'm going to focus on the here and now... we shouldn't look like we did on Friday night, and we shouldn't lose to Purdue by 30 points, or whatever it ended up being, ever. It amplifies all the concerns, and overshadows all the positive things he's brought and done. Gotta get back on track and play well and beat NW convincingly. A loss tomorrow night... and I might jump in the car with you... ha ha.
Seriously though, I still don't think its on the level of bad that you do. I think he's more than capable of being very successful at IU. But its hard to even think about the good things after watching whatever that was on Friday night. So disappointing.
And then how they immediately dismissed it, and said they're looking forward to the last 4 games... Phuck that... maybe share some frustration with getting curb stomped by your biggest rival... Someone give a Tim Tebow esque speech... I'm with you on some of those types of concerns. Its NOT how CDD is personally wired, I know that for a fact. He is a dawg. Hopefully he does a better job filling his next roster with some dawgs too... Outside Enright, there might not be another one on the team.
We could've had Chris Beard and completely collapse in our third season! ( j/k OT )
Need some wins. I think 10-10 gets us in, although a Big Ten tourney win may be required due to the blowouts we've suffered in our losses. (Play in game, if no tourney win?) Looking scary as to whether we can get to 10 wins in the Big. A 3-1 hot finish we are solidly in.
@hoosiers94 I get that. There are a LOT of factors that go into whether or not to fire a coach. His roster is extremely flawed. The questions that need to be asked when evaluating this are:
1. If you give him the NIL resources that other programs have can he put together a roster that can win bigger?
2. Instead of paying the buyout of the staff and hiring a whole new staff, would that money be better invested in players? His system is solid. The issue is personnel for the most part.
3. What's the actual interest in the job? IU isn't prying Dusty May from Michigan, the Brad Stevens pipe dream is dead. IU won't bring in some one like Beard with baggage. Good coaches aren't going to want to come coach and be told you have a year, make the sweet 16 or we are moving on.
4. What is IU? It's been a decade since IU went to a sweet 16, nearly 25 years since they went past that and nearly 40 since they have won it all. So what is IU? Are they chasing a ghost of the Bobby Knight ERA? Or is this just a case of people not knowing how to evaluate a coach? Are the tools in place to give ANY coach an actual chance to win? College sports has changed, has IUBB evolved to keep up? Football did. Basketball seemingly has not.
Look at the landscape surrounding IUBB. There is so much apathy. I credit you for still being angry or upset, but there is a lot more shoulder shrugs than anger these days. Assembly Hall has thousands of empty seats every game, there is no real buzz for games. IU plays a result happens and people just seem to move on. The damage the two previous staffs did was way worse than most acknowledged, so I get the fear of hanging on too long again, but one season is an over correction.
He'll have a short leash, but not as short as you want it. I said IU would win between 9-11 Big Ten games and that's probably what they are going to do. Is that good enough to throw a parade? No. Is it bad enough to get fired in year one? No.
I think expectations from some also need to be based in reality and the reality this year was IU has a coach in Year One that people were very underwhelmed with. The roster had obvious limitations and this team had an obvious ceiling. They are EXACTLY who I thought they were. Can win games when shooting well...will look like crap when not.
@hoosiers94 I get that. There are a LOT of factors that go into whether or not to fire a coach. His roster is extremely flawed. The questions that need to be asked when evaluating this are:
1. If you give him the NIL resources that other programs have can he put together a roster that can win bigger?
2. Instead of paying the buyout of the staff and hiring a whole new staff, would that money be better invested in players? His system is solid. The issue is personnel for the most part.
3. What's the actual interest in the job? IU isn't prying Dusty May from Michigan, the Brad Stevens pipe dream is dead. IU won't bring in some one like Beard with baggage. Good coaches aren't going to want to come coach and be told you have a year, make the sweet 16 or we are moving on.
4. What is IU? It's been a decade since IU went to a sweet 16, nearly 25 years since they went past that and nearly 40 since they have won it all. So what is IU? Are they chasing a ghost of the Bobby Knight ERA? Or is this just a case of people not knowing how to evaluate a coach? Are the tools in place to give ANY coach an actual chance to win? College sports has changed, has IUBB evolved to keep up? Football did. Basketball seemingly has not.
Look at the landscape surrounding IUBB. There is so much apathy. I credit you for still being angry or upset, but there is a lot more shoulder shrugs than anger these days. Assembly Hall has thousands of empty seats every game, there is no real buzz for games. IU plays a result happens and people just seem to move on. The damage the two previous staffs did was way worse than most acknowledged, so I get the fear of hanging on too long again, but one season is an over correction.
He'll have a short leash, but not as short as you want it. I said IU would win between 9-11 Big Ten games and that's probably what they are going to do. Is that good enough to throw a parade? No. Is it bad enough to get fired in year one? No.
I think expectations from some also need to be based in reality and the reality this year was IU has a coach in Year One that people were very underwhelmed with. The roster had obvious limitations and this team had an obvious ceiling. They are EXACTLY who I thought they were. Can win games when shooting well...will look like crap when not.
so if you're correct in your assessment, then the blame is squarely on the University for allowing this to happen. Now they have to spend the money to correct it. It's much cheaper to retain greatness than it is to create it. So if they are even remotely serious about basketball, which I have my doubts now that football is the best thing since sliced bread, then they will have to be top 5 in NIL money for this portal cycle. And also for incoming freshman prospects...so the class of 2027 has to be top shelf. If not then it's over. It's just something to pass the time after football is over. If that's what they want then it is what it is, then just announce their intentions to the fanbase so we don't have to continue to be disappointed. For me that would be a disappointment , announced or not. Although I am tickled pink that the football team is National Champs , I'm. At heart a basketball fan , and most specifically an IU basketball fan. It's part of who a lot of us are, now it's not the end of the world but it does certainly leave a void. Again not the end of the world and we will all survive but it just sucks.