I can't get over the very real possibility that if we had just canned Woody a year earlier.... Dusty May would be our head coach and we'd be a top-5 team as we speak. That's the story of IU basketball this century- a day late and a dollar short.
I’m skeptical (that we would be a top 5 team had we hired May). This two game stretch may have IU fans wishing we had made a different hire, but if I am either of those 2 coaches I am breathing a sigh of relief. IU is a low ceiling, coach killing program right now. Or, should I say IU is a low floor and low ceiling program?
@gerdis So you think the odds would even be stacked against great coaches here? Elaborate on the reasons you see it that way.
There are a couple of high end coaches found every year. If you never get one, its the entire program, or lack of one, that is the problem, not a specific coach. We would have messed up the May hire. Said not enough experience, or something.
Nothing to do now but hope our guy turns it around. Or, alternatively hope he tanks so badly he doesnt get a third year. Ill hope for turnaround.
But, recruiting is going to be tough. Who wants to play for the dregs of basketball. Like playing football for Purdue.
@openwheel Conventional wisdom says it’s much easier to turn around a basketball program than it is a football program. We’ve turned that notion on its’ head.
@gerdis I disagree. May would have been successful here just like he's been at Michigan. He's obviously an excellent coach and would have done here what he's doing there.
@gerdis So you think the odds would even be stacked against great coaches here? Elaborate on the reasons you see it that way.
o suspect that the issue is above the coach. IU basketball clearly has a culture issue, and that cannot change without addressing the root cause. I suspect that root cause lies with whoever truly controls and owns the program- IU administration people and outside forces (boosters/etc.).
Perhaps May would have been very successful here. Maybe not. Imho, it isn’t just about coaching or players. There is a whole lot more to the job, and it requires a very unique and strong personality.
It seems premature to want to get rid of Coach DD after only one year, BUT I do agree that he has the personality of a door knob. The team is reflective of the coach, i.e. Cig. IU basketball needs a Hurley type coach who gets after it with players, refs, and everyone. Some personality that's kids want to play for. The closeups of Devries during the game showed a coach sweating, wide eyed, and looking like "what do I do"?
@gerdis So you think the odds would even be stacked against great coaches here? Elaborate on the reasons you see it that way.
o suspect that the issue is above the coach. IU basketball clearly has a culture issue, and that cannot change without addressing the root cause. I suspect that root cause lies with whoever truly controls and owns the program- IU administration people and outside forces (boosters/etc.).
Perhaps May would have been very successful here. Maybe not. Imho, it isn’t just about coaching or players. There is a whole lot more to the job, and it requires a very unique and strong personality.
Great or elite coaches have elite results everywhere. There's nothing preventing a good coach from succeeding here if one were actually hired.
This concept of yours would also indicate that the failed coaches we have hired failed because of IU and not their own ineptitudes? Thats proven false when we see that Davis, Crean and Archie all have failed miserably once they left IU (Davis fired multiple times. Crean a disaster at Georgia, no longer coaching. Archie taking 4 years to even be competitive at RI.). Woodson couldn't buy another head coaching job either.
Those guys didn't fail because of IU, they failed because they were all mediocre and in over their heads (and in Woodson's case a guy who should have never been interviewed to begin with).
@gerdis So you think the odds would even be stacked against great coaches here? Elaborate on the reasons you see it that way.
o suspect that the issue is above the coach. IU basketball clearly has a culture issue, and that cannot change without addressing the root cause. I suspect that root cause lies with whoever truly controls and owns the program- IU administration people and outside forces (boosters/etc.).
Perhaps May would have been very successful here. Maybe not. Imho, it isn’t just about coaching or players. There is a whole lot more to the job, and it requires a very unique and strong personality.
Great or elite coaches have elite results everywhere. There's nothing preventing a good coach from succeeding here if one were actually hired.
This concept of yours would also indicate that the failed coaches we have hired failed because of IU and not their own ineptitudes? Thats proven false when we see that Davis, Crean and Archie all have failed miserably once they left IU (Davis fired multiple times. Crean a disaster at Georgia, no longer coaching. Archie taking 4 years to even be competitive at RI.). Woodson couldn't buy another head coaching job either.
Those guys didn't fail because of IU, they failed because they were all mediocre and in over their heads (and in Woodson's case a guy who should have never been interviewed to begin with).
It seems premature to want to get rid of Coach DD after only one year, BUT I do agree that he has the personality of a door knob. The team is reflective of the coach, i.e. Cig. IU basketball needs a Hurley type coach who gets after it with players, refs, and everyone. Some personality that's kids want to play for. The closeups of Devries during the game showed a coach sweating, wide eyed, and looking like "what do I do"?
A lot of similarities between these 2. Deer in the headlights look on the sideline and in press conferences. Zero answers or confidence. I do think DeVries is the much better coach though. Gonna be hard to turn around though without more money.
It seems premature to want to get rid of Coach DD after only one year, BUT I do agree that he has the personality of a door knob. The team is reflective of the coach, i.e. Cig. IU basketball needs a Hurley type coach who gets after it with players, refs, and everyone. Some personality that's kids want to play for. The closeups of Devries during the game showed a coach sweating, wide eyed, and looking like "what do I do"?
A lot of similarities between these 2. Deer in the headlights look on the sideline and in press conferences. Zero answers or confidence. I do think DeVries is the much better coach though. Gonna be hard to turn around though without more money.
maybe he knows basketball, maybe he's got a high basketball iq... I disagree, but let's say he does. To me that's not his biggest problem. He's unable to motivate or disseminate the message to the boys and get them to the point they want to run though a brick wall for him. Nor does he communicate it in a way to keep their focus and drive alive. To me that's an assistant coach role .. is what he's giving. That to me disqualifies him from this job going forward. Simply knowing X's and O's is great and a must but definitely not the only thing this job requires. He doesn't have it. He's got the personality of a door knob. In fact since I've coined that on this forum I'm going to give him that nickname going forward. Ala Bigfoot. Doorknob can't coach and can't lead.
Not hiring somewhat of an asshole was just dumb. IU has bob knight dna in it. Thats why when cig game in and said Purdue sucks but so does michhhhhhagen and ahhhhia state. I was like this guy is either fucking nuts or we got something here. IU loves a cocky ahole. Can this dude now let me hire the next coach.
Not hiring somewhat of an asshole was just dumb. IU has bob knight dna in it. Thats why when cig game in and said Purdue sucks but so does michhhhhhagen and ahhhhia state. I was like this guy is either fucking nuts or we got something here. IU loves a cocky ahole. Can this dude now let me hire the next coach.
Who would that be?
Not hiring somewhat of an asshole was just dumb. IU has bob knight dna in it. Thats why when cig game in and said Purdue sucks but so does michhhhhhagen and ahhhhia state. I was like this guy is either fucking nuts or we got something here. IU loves a cocky ahole. Can this dude now let me hire the next coach.
Actually I've always agreed with this 100%. The whole "he's a great guy, great family man, etc" BS almost always means you're about to get your ass kicked. Whether it's DeVries, Crean, Davis, Cameron, Lynch, Allen, Pagano, Reich, etc it's always the same result. We need a stone cold killer not a family man.
We need someone like Chris Beard or Bruce Pearl.
@gerdis So you think the odds would even be stacked against great coaches here? Elaborate on the reasons you see it that way.
o suspect that the issue is above the coach. IU basketball clearly has a culture issue, and that cannot change without addressing the root cause. I suspect that root cause lies with whoever truly controls and owns the program- IU administration people and outside forces (boosters/etc.).
Perhaps May would have been very successful here. Maybe not. Imho, it isn’t just about coaching or players. There is a whole lot more to the job, and it requires a very unique and strong personality.
Great or elite coaches have elite results everywhere. There's nothing preventing a good coach from succeeding here if one were actually hired.
This concept of yours would also indicate that the failed coaches we have hired failed because of IU and not their own ineptitudes? Thats proven false when we see that Davis, Crean and Archie all have failed miserably once they left IU (Davis fired multiple times. Crean a disaster at Georgia, no longer coaching. Archie taking 4 years to even be competitive at RI.). Woodson couldn't buy another head coaching job either.
Those guys didn't fail because of IU, they failed because they were all mediocre and in over their heads (and in Woodson's case a guy who should have never been interviewed to begin with).
Archie isn’t even competitive in his fourth season and will likely be fired. There is nothing about IU that makes coaches fail. They fail because they are bad coaches. Period.