@openwheel You guys are right. It is time for me to stop crying over spilled milk.
While I regarded God as a tyrant I thought my sin a trifle; But when I knew Him to be my Father, then I mourned that I could ever have kicked against Him. When I thought God was hard, I found it easy to sin; but when I found God so kind, so good, so overflowing with compassion, I smote upon my breast to think that I could ever have rebelled against One who loved me so, and sought my good.” C. H. Spurgeon
Everybody understands being frustrated with our history of poor BB coaching choices. Especially the most recent before DeVries.🤣
I always wonder if we had an opening before May got to Michigan, at least the same year he signed with them. Would Indiana have been smart enough to make a very strong push for May? My gut says no... So I only believe the 'he was never coming here' talk in the sense that 'I know, we wouldn't have been smart enough to make it really tough to turn us down.' Maybe he was never coming, but we will never know to a certainty. I am sure we reached out this time, but he already had his great gig.
I think what a lot of you guys don’t understand is that there are people around Bloomington who are quite close with members of Dusty’s family. They are local people. We can trust that people know the situation. Many knew that he didn’t want to be in the IU crucible long before the UM job ever opened. Don’t waste your emotions on that being a loss for or a mistake by IU. It was just not in the cards.Everybody understands being frustrated with our history of poor BB coaching choices. Especially the most recent before DeVries.🤣
I always wonder if we had an opening before May got to Michigan, at least the same year he signed with them. Would Indiana have been smart enough to make a very strong push for May? My gut says no... So I only believe the 'he was never coming here' talk in the sense that 'I know, we wouldn't have been smart enough to make it really tough to turn us down.' Maybe he was never coming, but we will never know to a certainty. I am sure we reached out this time, but he already had his great gig.
OK , I guess we still have enough things to rag on our athletic admin for in basketball.
(And I haven't been on the 'shouldve had Dusty May!' bandwagon, I was on the 'we wouldn't have been smart enough anyway even with better timing' ...)
@walt542 I think most anyone that "knows people" within the IU buildings, knows this to be true. The only pushback I have with regards to IU's efforts with May... This entire narrative is pretty easy for the Mays, his Bloomington family and friends, etc... because IU never really made a serious run at him, at the right time.
This is just my understanding... I think its accurate, but obviously I'm not actually there, so who knows... Dolson did reach out to May on a couple different occasions to gauge interest. Near the end, and immediately after Woodsons 3rd year. And then during and immediately after Woodson's final year.
I think the decision becomes quite a lot more "real" and difficult, for Dusty... if IU had fired Woodson after his 3rd season, and went after May full bore, with an actual job opening. As it was, Woodson was still employed, so there was never really an actual real decision for May to make on IU. After May got to Michigan, the ship had for sure sailed, so the efforts that offseason weren't ever going to lead anywhere.
I think if any version of the above is true (I believe it is), then its a pretty important distinction. The IU decision makers shouldn't be completely let off the hook, but its not as egregious a mistake as most on here make it out to be. But going forward, when its obvious, as it had to be to most after Woodson's year 3... cut bait, find the next guy. I would say the same thing about CDD after THIS next season. If we're a bubble team or worse, and limp to the finish like we did in his first year... cut bait, find the next guy. And for sure make the move if there's someone like May, that's even a possibility. Because the chances increase exponentially, in most cases, when you have an actual job opening... versus back channel interest gauging.
OK, you are correct that IU did not go hard after Dusty and make him make that decision with an actual offer on the line because they still had Woodson. Maybe he could have been swayed, but people I know don’t think that is the case, particularly after UM got into the picture. Fun to speculate though.@walt542 I think most anyone that "knows people" within the IU buildings, knows this to be true. The only pushback I have with regards to IU's efforts with May... This entire narrative is pretty easy for the Mays, his Bloomington family and friends, etc... because IU never really made a serious run at him, at the right time.
This is just my understanding... I think its accurate, but obviously I'm not actually there, so who knows... Dolson did reach out to May on a couple different occasions to gauge interest. Near the end, and immediately after Woodsons 3rd year. And then during and immediately after Woodson's final year.
I think the decision becomes quite a lot more "real" and difficult, for Dusty... if IU had fired Woodson after his 3rd season, and went after May full bore, with an actual job opening. As it was, Woodson was still employed, so there was never really an actual real decision for May to make on IU. After May got to Michigan, the ship had for sure sailed, so the efforts that offseason weren't ever going to lead anywhere.
I think if any version of the above is true (I believe it is), then its a pretty important distinction. The IU decision makers shouldn't be completely let off the hook, but its not as egregious a mistake as most on here make it out to be. But going forward, when its obvious, as it had to be to most after Woodson's year 3... cut bait, find the next guy. I would say the same thing about CDD after THIS next season. If we're a bubble team or worse, and limp to the finish like we did in his first year... cut bait, find the next guy. And for sure make the move if there's someone like May, that's even a possibility. Because the chances increase exponentially, in most cases, when you have an actual job opening... versus back channel interest gauging.
Braden Smith to the Pacers. I loathe all things Boilers, but as a Pacers fan I can learn to live with it, as a 3rd string PG. Last year they played some games with shooting / "combo" guards at point (Sheppard, Taelon Peter, Quentin Jackson) due to injuries and they showed why they can't play the point, even in a deep backup role. Smith is 5'10", the shortest player drafted in like 10 years, so being a smurf will be an issue. But the basketball IQ and toughness is undeniable. He's also not as annoyingly punchable as Fletcher Loyer or Kaufmann-Renn.
"You can't make someone listen to reason if they aren't willing to think"-- Ray Bradbury, Fahrenheit 451
... He's also not as annoyingly punchable as Fletcher Loyer or Kaufmann-Renn.OK, not as annoyingly punchable, but still annoyingly punchable.
Well, as a Pacer fan, he's now one of my guys. I hope he can play. Got a chance.
... He's also not as annoyingly punchable as Fletcher Loyer or Kaufmann-Renn.OK, not as annoyingly punchable, but still annoyingly punchable.Well, as a Pacer fan, he's now one of my guys. I hope he can play. Got a chance.
Pacers are morons. They had a chance at Alford and went with the skinny kid from somewhere out west.
Reminds me of when they took Billy Keller out of Purdue. I hated that but learned to love him as a Pacer. You’ll get over it if he can play the pro game.Braden Smith to the Pacers. I loathe all things Boilers, but as a Pacers fan I can learn to live with it, as a 3rd string PG. Last year they played some games with shooting / "combo" guards at point (Sheppard, Taelon Peter, Quentin Jackson) due to injuries and they showed why they can't play the point, even in a deep backup role. Smith is 5'10", the shortest player drafted in like 10 years, so being a smurf will be an issue. But the basketball IQ and toughness is undeniable. He's also not as annoyingly punchable as Fletcher Loyer or Kaufmann-Renn.
@shooter I think he'll probably end up being a solid deep bench guy, and obviously will be a fan favorite. I fought with our own fans for months when I made the call 3 minutes in to his college career that he was "going to be a problem", and then a few games in to his career that he was going to become one of the best players in the B10. So, I obviously like his game.
But man, there were some pretty darn good players drafted after him, that I think would have had better chances at being main rotation level guys. If you wanted a point guard, guys like Gillespie and Jaden Bradley have a much better chance at being impactful rotation guys, and wouldn't be big defensive liabilities like Smith is. And then there were so many guys with length... something very highly coveted by basically all franchises... Bilodeau, Okpara, Nickel, Hopkins, Veesaar... All had first round grades in some fashion...
Basically... top 40 draft picks, and the resources it takes to trade in to them, are almost always made for players that should compete for main rotation spots. If Smith ends up being a main rotation player, that likely means Hali isn't healthy, AND then McConnell/Nembhard aren't capable of manning it... any of those scenarios that leads to Smith playing a lot are bad news.
I guess its a good story. I think he's fun to watch. And I'll be rooting for him. But I think after you get over the emotions and nostalgia side, which shouldn't drive decisions like this, it wasn't a very good decision to trade the assets, and then choose him at that spot.
@walt542 Sichting was a Purdue grad who played for the Pacers also. I'm terrible at predicting who will make it in the NBA, and I've loved Smith's game and smarts, but seems like he'll be such a defensive liability, hard for me to see him sticking.
Purdue just got a commitment from Kevin Savage. That is not good. He’s gonna be a stud in college. He’ll take the ball, basically day 1, from Ertel, I’ll bet.
Scott Skiles was a 'defensive liability' but he later found a way. As far as past Pacer players.
Maybe Braden can find his niche.
I agree though on preferring a guy with athleticism, potential. Hope the Pacers are right.
@openwheel I think he could be good enough, and popular enough, that most Pacers fans will end up thinking it was a good move and pick. And in the end, maybe that's a good enough measure?... Buzz, vibe, juice... having that extra feeling again is hugely important. Hali being back will help with that, but having Smith on the roster, and playing, will as well. I just think, longer term, there were better and more impactful guys they could have taken... Smith at the 38th pick is questionable. Smith at 38, because you traded away some future draft capital to get that pick, well, we'll see I guess, but I don't know...