@arioznahoosier4554 I think it would be cool to have a team that "could" win a B10 title, every year. Winning it will remain a big deal, until we do it. But my hope is IU gets to a point where we have a program that's expected to be playing on the weekend, basically every season. At THAT point, probably won't really care all that much whether we actually win it or not.
I am been hoping that for 25 years but have gotten to a point I really have a hard time seeing it happen. I am just thankful we now have football. Michigan does a great job hiring the guys we pass up in bbal. I dont like the word doomed but our bbal program really does seem doomed
I know a mid-major coach who would fit quite well at Butler.
Clark Kellogg picked Purdue to win the title.
[Insert joke here.]
@arioznahoosier4554 Odds are they'll get the right guy here at some point. But with each whiff, it sure does increase the pressure and the skepticism that they will. I feel pretty confident it won't end up being a proven guy like May, or LLoyd, or Golden now, or whoever... that might want to resurrect a giant of a program. It'll end up being someone like DeVries, or Schertz, or some other name we haven't thought of yet, or that isn't even coaching yet.
Despite the definitive calls made by a few of our more confident posters... its not determined already that CDD isn't "the guy". Lots of red flags, lots of doubts. But there are very real, and recent examples of coaches stepping up to a high profile P4 job from smaller schools, being very mediocre for a couple years (worse than CDD has been at WVU/IU), and then figuring things out and thriving. Obviously there are different dynamics and personalities at play... but I keep bringing up Todd Golden and Dan Hurley as these examples. Those two are not remotely similar to each other. Golden isn't a "dynamic personality"... he has kind of an analytical, nerdy personality and demeanor. And Hurley, he's a lunatic. But both spent a couple years building their programs, then things clicked for each of them in year 2, and then really took off in years 3. Hurley is from a higher profile family, so maybe his comp isn't a great one. But I think Golden could be.
Obviously there is the real possibility that CDD ends up more like Archie though, too. Its just way to early to make that call definitively.
@arioznahoosier4554 Odds are they'll get the right guy here at some point. But with each whiff, it sure does increase the pressure and the skepticism that they will. I feel pretty confident it won't end up being a proven guy like May, or LLoyd, or Golden now, or whoever... that might want to resurrect a giant of a program. It'll end up being someone like DeVries, or Schertz, or some other name we haven't thought of yet, or that isn't even coaching yet.
Despite the definitive calls made by a few of our more confident posters... its not determined already that CDD isn't "the guy". Lots of red flags, lots of doubts. But there are very real, and recent examples of coaches stepping up to a high profile P4 job from smaller schools, being very mediocre for a couple years (worse than CDD has been at WVU/IU), and then figuring things out and thriving. Obviously there are different dynamics and personalities at play... but I keep bringing up Todd Golden and Dan Hurley as these examples. Those two are not remotely similar to each other. Golden isn't a "dynamic personality"... he has kind of an analytical, nerdy personality and demeanor. And Hurley, he's a lunatic. But both spent a couple years building their programs, then things clicked for each of them in year 2, and then really took off in years 3. Hurley is from a higher profile family, so maybe his comp isn't a great one. But I think Golden could be.
Obviously there is the real possibility that CDD ends up more like Archie though, too. Its just way to early to make that call definitively.
They have been trying for 25 years yes if they keep trying at some point they will finally get a good coach but who knows when could be another 15 years. But I do think the current guy will challenge for big ten and national titles? No I do not but if Dolson is ok with 21 wins and an 8 seeds in the tourney he will probably be your guy. That is just going off what I have seen so far.
@arioznahoosier4554 Odds are they'll get the right guy here at some point. But with each whiff, it sure does increase the pressure and the skepticism that they will. I feel pretty confident it won't end up being a proven guy like May, or LLoyd, or Golden now, or whoever... that might want to resurrect a giant of a program. It'll end up being someone like DeVries, or Schertz, or some other name we haven't thought of yet, or that isn't even coaching yet.
Despite the definitive calls made by a few of our more confident posters... its not determined already that CDD isn't "the guy". Lots of red flags, lots of doubts. But there are very real, and recent examples of coaches stepping up to a high profile P4 job from smaller schools, being very mediocre for a couple years (worse than CDD has been at WVU/IU), and then figuring things out and thriving. Obviously there are different dynamics and personalities at play... but I keep bringing up Todd Golden and Dan Hurley as these examples. Those two are not remotely similar to each other. Golden isn't a "dynamic personality"... he has kind of an analytical, nerdy personality and demeanor. And Hurley, he's a lunatic. But both spent a couple years building their programs, then things clicked for each of them in year 2, and then really took off in years 3. Hurley is from a higher profile family, so maybe his comp isn't a great one. But I think Golden could be.
Obviously there is the real possibility that CDD ends up more like Archie though, too. Its just way to early to make that call definitively.
For me most of it is his personality. Just not a good fit here imo. The fans want an alpha male. A real pipe hitter. DeVries is just boring. Has that constant deer in the headlights look. Reminds me of Archie except that he seems like a really nice guy not a curmudgeon. Just hard to see it working out. I feel like he's already lost half the fan base and probably can't get them back.
You mentioned Hurley. Someone like that is what the fans want. We'll likely have to get lucky in the mid major ranks to find one.
@arioznahoosier4554 Odds are they'll get the right guy here at some point. But with each whiff, it sure does increase the pressure and the skepticism that they will. I feel pretty confident it won't end up being a proven guy like May, or LLoyd, or Golden now, or whoever... that might want to resurrect a giant of a program. It'll end up being someone like DeVries, or Schertz, or some other name we haven't thought of yet, or that isn't even coaching yet.
Despite the definitive calls made by a few of our more confident posters... its not determined already that CDD isn't "the guy". Lots of red flags, lots of doubts. But there are very real, and recent examples of coaches stepping up to a high profile P4 job from smaller schools, being very mediocre for a couple years (worse than CDD has been at WVU/IU), and then figuring things out and thriving. Obviously there are different dynamics and personalities at play... but I keep bringing up Todd Golden and Dan Hurley as these examples. Those two are not remotely similar to each other. Golden isn't a "dynamic personality"... he has kind of an analytical, nerdy personality and demeanor. And Hurley, he's a lunatic. But both spent a couple years building their programs, then things clicked for each of them in year 2, and then really took off in years 3. Hurley is from a higher profile family, so maybe his comp isn't a great one. But I think Golden could be.
Obviously there is the real possibility that CDD ends up more like Archie though, too. Its just way to early to make that call definitively.
For me most of it is his personality. Just not a good fit here imo. The fans want an alpha male. A real pipe hitter. DeVries is just boring. Has that constant deer in the headlights look. Reminds me of Archie except that he seems like a really nice guy not a curmudgeon. Just hard to see it working out. I feel like he's already lost half the fan base and probably can't get them back.
You mentioned Hurley. Someone like that is what the fans want. We'll likely have to get lucky in the mid major ranks to find one.
I agree with you I tried to watch one of his press conferences and had to turn it off. Talk about putting a guy to sleep. As I mentioned before if Dolson is ok with a guy who can max out at like 21 wins and get an 8 seed some years DD is his guy. But I doubt you will ever see him do better than that at IU. The fit like you said just does not seem right.
@dbmhoosier The fans want to start winning. If we were winning, and still playing, fans would not be grousing about CDDs courtside manner. A coach going apesh*t and getting T'd up every other game might be fun for a while but not if it comes with a 0.500 record and missing the tournament.
Look at Dusty May. He seems even-tempered, not really intimidating, has kind of a high voice, who cares... he's winning.
@jackskip23 It wasn’t a few people. It was so bad ( not just him but bad mouthing the players) that Painter spoke to the media about it.m
@jackskip23 I’m sorry you think you know more. Why do you think Painter addressed their toxic fan base? It was nice to know we aren’t the only ones. What information exactly are you using to definitively say my post was wrong?
@arioznahoosier4554 what you have seen is one year with a very flawed roster.
@dbmhoosier I certainly don’t want someone with the demeanor of Hurley. I remember after Woodson, everyone was saying they just wanted a normal guy that would work hard. There are definitely some worrisome signs, but I don’t think one season , with a flawed roster is enough to come to a conclusion. As for personality, I don’t seem some of the best coaches had huge personalities. Dean Smith, Coach K, Bill Self?
@zeke4ahs interesting thread. So, the gist is that PU was having such a terrible season for them that fans were upset with Painter. And that an awful PU season still has them trending towards a collapse to a 3-4 seed?
When was IUs last seed in that range, 20 years ago?
@dbmhoosier I certainly don’t want someone with the demeanor of Hurley. I remember after Woodson, everyone was saying they just wanted a normal guy that would work hard. There are definitely some worrisome signs, but I don’t think one season , with a flawed roster is enough to come to a conclusion. As for personality, I don’t seem some of the best coaches had huge personalities. Dean Smith, Coach K, Bill Self?
Those guys were all killers. Same for Dusty May. He might put out that choir boy image for the cameras but behind the scenes I'd bet he's a killer. Lot of coaches don't seem to like him especially Izzo. Lots of rumors of him tampering with other players. We need someone willing to get into the mud. I guarantee you Coach K was no Saint. Self? Lol
@arioznahoosier4554 Odds are they'll get the right guy here at some point. But with each whiff, it sure does increase the pressure and the skepticism that they will. I feel pretty confident it won't end up being a proven guy like May, or LLoyd, or Golden now, or whoever... that might want to resurrect a giant of a program. It'll end up being someone like DeVries, or Schertz, or some other name we haven't thought of yet, or that isn't even coaching yet.
Despite the definitive calls made by a few of our more confident posters... its not determined already that CDD isn't "the guy". Lots of red flags, lots of doubts. But there are very real, and recent examples of coaches stepping up to a high profile P4 job from smaller schools, being very mediocre for a couple years (worse than CDD has been at WVU/IU), and then figuring things out and thriving. Obviously there are different dynamics and personalities at play... but I keep bringing up Todd Golden and Dan Hurley as these examples. Those two are not remotely similar to each other. Golden isn't a "dynamic personality"... he has kind of an analytical, nerdy personality and demeanor. And Hurley, he's a lunatic. But both spent a couple years building their programs, then things clicked for each of them in year 2, and then really took off in years 3. Hurley is from a higher profile family, so maybe his comp isn't a great one. But I think Golden could be.
Obviously there is the real possibility that CDD ends up more like Archie though, too. Its just way to early to make that call definitively.
For me most of it is his personality. Just not a good fit here imo. The fans want an alpha male. A real pipe hitter. DeVries is just boring. Has that constant deer in the headlights look. Reminds me of Archie except that he seems like a really nice guy not a curmudgeon. Just hard to see it working out. I feel like he's already lost half the fan base and probably can't get them back.
You mentioned Hurley. Someone like that is what the fans want. We'll likely have to get lucky in the mid major ranks to find one.
I agree with the comments about his personality. Although I agree with Zeke that you can be a calmer type and still be effective, there has to be SOMETHING there. Even guys like Dean Smith, Matt Painter, Roy Williams, Dusty May are more interesting than DeVries. Has he EVER said anything about basketball, coaching, society, or life in general that you found particularly interesting or insightful? That would be a No. What did we hear about him coming in? "Competitive"---sorry, haven't seen it. And it's a worrisome sign that he reportedly has never had a T as a head coach, especially considering the rather routine screw jobs we were getting from the refs this year. "Hard working"? I don't know. P.R. was a beach party, and that's how he introduced himself to us. Was his team a hard-working team? Meh. "Player's Coach"? Probably. There were no critical assessments of any individual players. Certainly a lack of real honesty as to what was going on on the court.
But I think there's a second issue as well, namely his game prep & coaching bonafides. How was he on out-of-bound plays, offensively and defensively? Mediocre. What about shot selection? Average at best. Rebounding technique? Not so great. Closing out games? Yikes. Installing confidence and competitiveness in his players? They quit on the season. We don't know why but we know they did,
Bottom line.....with our resources and administrative patience he may survive another 2 years or longer. But I see a ceiling of Sweet 16, and a floor of again missing the tourney altogether.
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